Vice Presidential Debate!

Be sure to watch the VIce-Presidential debate. The link to watch online is located here.

Check back afterwords and give us your thoughts and impressions.


  1. Man, Sarah Palin should get down on her knees and thank the person who created the 3×5 notecard. It’s like she’s a Univac One mainframe. Pull out the punchcard and she shuts down.

  2. Antifederalist says

    Untersturnfuhrer Klute,
    B.O. Barackus Apollo NObama could benefit from using some 3×5 cards himself. He’s shut down before when he’s had tech problems with his teleprompters. Sometimes low-tech is the way to go.

    Now, if you’ve got something substandive to say, pipe up, but let’s not just regurgitate the Kool-Aid talking points you’ve been spoonfed by your Party.

  3. “spoonfed by your Party”

    “B.O. Barackus Apollo NObama”

    But anyway…

    Yeah, I’ve got a substansive to say. First off, how exactly does “John McCain know how to win a war”? Which war did he win? What battleplan did he implement which crushed the enemy? Someone explain it to me.

    How can the US maintain the surge level strength in Iraq which is needed under the Bush doctrine and surge in Afghanistan?

  4. kralmajales says

    Sarah Palin was destroyed tonight. Biden killed her. She couldn’t answer a straight question and her best lines were just that. Greed and corruption on Wall Street…and Maverick…over and over and over again. She never said how he was as maverick, how she was, nor ever how she’d root out greed on wall street.

  5. kralmajales says

    By the way, the real news of today was what you all lost by putting her up. Romney. Did any of you catch that McCain pulled out of Michigan today? Something he would never have had to do if he had put up Romney…and Romney would have held his own or even won tonight.

    You know…you KNOW…I am right about that.

  6. nightcrawler says


    Biden is a skilled orator with decades of experience arguing his points in front of a group. In my mind, the pressure was on him not her. He was not overly impressive, not as abrasive as I expected mind you, just adequate.

    Palin outperformed expectations.

    Hang on Klute, the race is not over.

    President John McCain. Say it over and over so you can get accustomed..

  7. nightcrawler says


    New Mexico and Colorado will go Red so it all evens out.

  8. First impressions: She is still doing the mini-stump speeches but she had some moments where she got out of the box.

    Given the fact that she has not been running around Congress for the last 30 years and does not know every jot and tittle like Biden and McCain, I think she did well. As she said, she’s only been doing this for 5 weeks. Her connections to mainstream American and family allows her to communicate much better than any Washington insider.

    Look, I didn’t to expect her to give us a lecture or dissertation on mid-east nuclear proliferation. That comes from being on the job.

    Prescription: Let her out of the campaign box and let her start slugging! You learn how to be a better campaigner when you’re out on your own making the hits and taking the hits.

  9. kralmajales says

    Good points DSW, but remember this, she had the opportunity tonight to slug. When she did, her punches were deflected easily by Biden. When Biden came out slugging he tore into McCain…and when he did that…she stammered away with no real answers at all.

    The only impressive part of her performance was that she appeared likeable and that she exceeded expectations.

    But anyone can exceed expectations when they were as utterly low as she started.

    Finally, the CNN poll of those who watched. Biden was judge to have won 51% to 36%. She exceeded expectations massively…but so did he (and that is telling since he was expected to win). Finally, the kicker for why she is a massive mistake for McCain.

    On the question of whether she showed she had what it takes to be President. Before, is was 43% percent said “Yes” with a majority against. After, it was 46% that said “yes” with the very same majority against. And…it was within the margin of error.

    Romney might have won the debate…and Romney would have meant that you were still in the game in Michigan.

    Oh…and on NM and Colorado? NM is going Obama…Colorado might go McCain..but it went for Bush too.

  10. kralmajales says

    By the way, on the family stuff, what on earth is that baby doing up at a rally at 10 PM?????

    Have any of you ever had a baby? If you did, you can bet that they would not be at a freakin rally…and after 8 PM.

  11. She did extremely well and I ready for the McCain team to get back on track. This will do it.

  12. I was going to comment but am laughing so hard that Klute and Kral have nothing better to do post comments on righty blog during the debate. Get a life.

  13. Palin was passable in the first hour and I think that was all the McCain campaign could really hope for as some of the recent Palin interviews are likely partly to blame for his poll numbers falling. The last 1/2 hour was really bad – I think she didn’t know what Achilles heel meant – but probably by then most people stopped watching. It will be interesting to see what excerpts get played in the next couple of days and how that affects opinion.

  14. Iris Lynch says

    I am with you, Nick! I worry that those guys have no warm bodies to chat with.

    Additionally, good old Joe, with his inability to come up with a creative string of words that he hasn’t stolen from someone else, and who can not manage to get his ‘facts’ right, was counted as having had at least 10 utterances that had no basis in fact. Dick Morris had a verbal spar with Colmes over it. Dick won.

    If SARAH had lied, it would be the headline in the Times (both coasts) in the morning. Funny how the left encourages winning at any cost.

    And I can’t help but wonder how much those cheats are drooling over the prospect of spending our 850 billions and plotting how much they can each manage to corral for themselves.

  15. kralmajales says

    She was creamed….and yeah…I was bored so I came to my friends here who I knew would be talking about the debate. And you were…weren’t you.

    I have to say…this blog is the most entertaining, and interesting, of all that I read. THAT is why I come back.

    That’s a compliment by the way.

  16. kralmajales says

    Hey…and I did wait until it was over…I watched the whole thing. Did ya’ll?

  17. Just so Nick and Iris don’t worry about my loneliness, I was watching the debate while chilling in the green room for my appearance on Grand Ave. Live in downtown Phoenix (hence the delay in responding).

    Gotta love that snap polling. 54% say Palin would be worse than or no different from Cheney. Ouch.

  18. kral
    How many kids do you have? I have 5, and they all survived my events that kept them out after 10pm. Really, is that an issue.

  19. Talk about lies??? Palin continued to use the line about saying “No thanks” to the bridge from nowhere even though video had been widely dispersed showing that she had supported it. McCain and Palin continue to state that Obama still refuses to admit that the surge succeeded when Obama had previously admitted on O’Reilly’s show that the had succeeded beyond his or our wildest dreams–he had also stated this during the first debate with McCain–McCain’s short-term memory must not be so good. Oh yeah–and the lie/distortion which the media has hit McCain on–Obama’s purported support for sex ed for kindergardeners… Go to SNL link below to video–hilarious–that exemplifies McCain’s campaign ad ethics.

    P.S. Palin’s performance sometimes had a stringing-together-of-talking-points aspect to it, so she did not appear as real, sincere or coherent as she could have. They should have let her just be herself.

  20. Let this mare out of the stable! It’s time for her to run and tear up the old stallions.

    Go Sarah!

  21. More reax:

    CNN vote of debate watchers: Biden 51, Palin 36

    CBS poll of undecideds: Biden 46, Palin 21

    And we all remember what happened in the last debate with snap polling like this.

  22. kralmajales says


    I have one baby boy. Wonderful that you have 5.

    Did you have your near to newborns out at political rally’s to show them off to the public…on stage…and awake after 11PM?

    I doubt it.

  23. Impressions: Biden is, at heart, a skilled plagiarist. From the first moment of the debate, he was using the “eight years of failed economic policies” line that Pelosi used to rally the House to support the rescue plan. Palin made repeated appeals for bipartisanship and I took that to mean both in taking credit and assigning blame. Clearly Palin is not beholden to vested interests and is willing to take on the status quo. However, she lacks experience, and fundamental knowledge of our institutions of government. Her description of the Constitutional role of the Veep’s office was bad. And, omg, I can’t bear to see another wink. Biden gave lots of openings, particularly on tax policy — “it’s a matter of fairness” to raise taxes on those that are already paying the most taxes— but Palin was ill equipped to land a punch. I hope no one again brings up this issue of “negotiating without preconditions” narrative — “did not”, “did to”, “did not”. Ugh.

  24. Annie Hoyle says

    I have 5 children also. What is the big deal? Babies that young go with their Mommy everywhere. Babies that young sleep wherever they are when they need to. I can assure you, that baby is VERY well cared for! What about Barak Obama’s young daughters that have been out late on TV many times! Are you concerned about them? Why, when it comes to Palin, do you all resort to picking apart issues about her children? Don’t you remember Biden’s story when he lost his wife? The surviving kids lost their mother and then their father still chose to be sworn in and so those kids had neither parent! The families of politicians ALL make sacrifices! Give it a rest!

  25. Annie Hoyle says

    Incidentally, I have had babies out that late many times…. scandalous!

  26. 2keyboards says

    I thoroughly enjoyed the debate. I thought Sarah was more than capable and held her own. I don’t know what debate you were watching but Fox poll had a completely different result. You know, where Sarah won? I’ve come to not trust CNN for conservative thought or to not be in the tank for Obama. Just yesterday morning they were still trying to say Sarah was a stupid hick. Joe came off looking like a fool at this debate. And, he had to resort to lies to have anything to say at all!!

  27. Antifederalist says

    Me? Spoonfed by my party? Are you HIGH?! Insane? Stupid? or all 3? I’m the small-government right-wing conservative that attacks McLame at every turn. I HATE most of what the AZ R Party does, and I REALLY hate what the RNC does. In fact, when the RNC asked me to return this year as an election Marshall, I told them to go take a hike. So, how am I some party tool like you are? I have YET to see you, on this blog, attack the Dems for ANYTHING. Most of my posts blast McLame and the RINOs that are in control of the R party.

    Before I get to your “substantive point”, I want to make clear that I’m not happy about spending tens of billions of dollars a year over in Iraq when we have problems to take care of at home. Additionally, I’m only angling to portray what Palin probably meant. McLame was one of the supporters of the surge strategy before it became reality. The meaning of the word “surge” suggests something temporary. Increased troop strength WAS temporary and AFAIK the additional surge numbers have been withdrawn. Also, the point of the surge was to crush the insurgents. They seem pretty shattered to me. If they weren’t, the leftist MSM would be making hay out of it every day. The media has been greatly SILENT on Iraq since the surge. The reason WHY they won’t report on Iraq anymore is because they don’t want to report either 1.) there’s little going on over there, or 2.) good news that accredits Bush.

    Also, Klute, your reference to the poll that says Palin would be worse than Cheney is just brainless. First, the responders are dumb, and you’re dumber for believing it. McLame will ride roughshod over Palin. He’ll tell her what to do and she’ll jump. That’s how McLame operates. While the left loves to think Cheney pulls Bush’s strings, such just won’t be the case with Palin.

  28. 2keyboards,

    The polling comes not just from CNN, but also CBS, and SurveyUSA all show Biden. You’ve really got to stop getting your news from one source.

    And the word today is that Palin staunched the blood loss, but little else. And the media is now talking about the bailout… The debate will be quickly overshadowed by that, and the next debate.

  29. Antifederalist says

    I want to make another point. As for all the polls, everyone should take note that news outlet polls are reflecting the mindset of their viewers. The leftists MSM outlets all boast polls that say Biden won. Fox and the other right wing-outlets are showing polls that say Palin won. Any Dims who rely on MSM polls are kidding themselves just as much as the Rs that rely on Fox polls on this one.

  30. AF,

    You obviously aren’t reading (not that I expect you to) my LJ. I go after Democrats (granted, maybe not with the same frequency as) just as a I go after Republicans. I dislike Biden for the bankruptucy bill, the RAVE Act (something I called the most unconstitutional law pre-Patriot Act), and as a writer, I’m uncomfortable with his plaigarism.

    If I agreed with something, I’d probably speak up – but, you know, I don’t particularly care that Ed Hermes lives with his parents, or that Harry Mitchell took money from someone who hasn’t been indicted or convicted (something Sarah Palin can’t say), and I’m not for enshrine discrimination in the state constitution. Give me an issue that I’m in agreement with, I’ll support it. Party means nothing to me. I vote the individual.

    Force levels in Iraq right now are 146,000. They were 162,000 at the high water mark, so we’re still in “surge” mode, but at the tail end. McKiernan (not McClellan, Sarah! – although I do hope McClellan takes Richmond before the fall) does not believe a “surge” will work – his exact words were “sustained committment” – whatever the hell that means (my guess is more blood and a lot more money).

    The surge was partially successful – we managed to stop dying – but the political climate is still screwed up. The Maliki government is constantly on the verge of collapse, and the Karzai government is in even worse shape, because we focused on Iraq.

    As for the Cheney thing, I never said the responders were smart or that Palin had the intellectual chops to be a puppet master like Cheney – my point was that when 54% people think that Palin is going to be like the guy who commands an 18% approval rating, it’s not good for your candidate.

  31. AF,

    I read the same “OMG! THE POLLS ARE BIASED!” claptrap on FreeRepublic all the time – I heard it a lot in 2006, especially (my personal favorites were the ones regarding Katherine Harris out of Florida). While there is statisical deviation (which is generally accounted for), and biased polling groups (Strategic Vision and PPP) and terrible pollsters (Zogby), ignore the polls at your own risk – SurveyUSA is one of the most reputable polling agencies in the nation, and they had highest accuracy during the primaries.

  32. Ack, numbers wrong, from the Washington Monthly:

    “Just before the surge policy was implemented, there were 132,000 U.S. troops in Iraq. As of September 2008, the number was 146,000.”

    So we’re still well within the “surge” period, and it goes back to my original point: How can we maintain force levels in Iraq, and forge a “sustained committment” in Afghanistan. No one’s answering that – and sure as hell not Palin, who insisted last night (and this morning, on Fox) that we’re back to pre-Surge level.

    And then what of Iran?

  33. Antifederalist says

    As for polls, I NEVER trust one of them, I see if the polls are within the margin of error, and I rather prefer poll aggregates like what RCP does. Even then, polls are often wrong. The Dem primary proved that on a couple of occasions. Frank Luntz predicted that mcLame would get a bounce out of the VP debate. I’ll be watching to see if he’s right. Otherwise, I’m gonna file him in the Perpetually Wrong category with Dick Morris.

    According to wiki, if it can be trusted, the total number of surge troops added to Iraq was 28K. If that’s true, and we’re currently up 14K from the troop number before the surge, then we’ve withdrawn at least half of what we put in. So, I wasn’t far off. I knew I had heard that surge troops had been withdrawn…and they have…just not all of them. Again, I’m not a great fan of spending tens or hundreds of billions of dollars in Iraq. I’m no fan of nationbuilding. That’s socialism and imperialism. President Washington warned us against entangling alliances and we’re in how many entangling engagements now?

    I’m also not a huge fan of propping up the Afghan government. I may agree that Iraq is a distraction…and expensive. The Taliban harbored al-Quaeda. They need to die. ALL of them. I’d be more than happy drawing every last man out of Iraq, sending them to Afghanistan, killing ANYONE even RUMORED to be a Taliban sympathizer, then using whatever means we need to to gakk bin Laden, then bringing our troops home. If Pakistan doesn’t like it, too frikken bad. They’re starting to look an awful lot like the Taliban in hindering us from killing bin Laden. After we get bin Laden, we need to pull all of our troops out of foreign countries and protect our own.

    As for Iran, they simply cannot be allowed to have the bomb. Sorry, yes, it IS an exclusive club, and the certifiably insane are not allowed to have nuclear weapons. I think we could quite easily bring that country to its knees by doing what we did to Iraq in the first Gulf War: bombing all their anit-air assets, eliminating their command and control, bombing every bridge and airport in the country, and then sinking or seizing all their shipping. Once we’ve completely cripped them, ask them if they still want the bomb. If they say yes, start bombing the rest of their infrastructure. If they say no, leave them alone to occupy themselves with rebuilding and tell them we’ll be back if we even get a HINT that they’re toying with the bomb again. I’ also resort to assassination in order to kill Mahmoud and all the idiot clerics that run Iran.

    As for the rest of the world’s reaction, I REALLY couldn’t care less. What? Is the UN gonna write us a letter telling us how upset they are with us? We should have bulldozed those losers into the East River YEARS ago.

    Yeah, yeah, I’m a big, mean, nasty, bloody hawk. Cry me a river.

    As for Biden, he proved to be WOEFULLY wrong on his history. Adams, as Washington’s VP,actually pesided over the Senate. Over time, that role has been left fallow, but it’s not unconstitutional. Biden should have known better. If he didn’t know that…what else doesn’t he know about the Constitution?

  34. “Otherwise, I’m gonna file him in the Perpetually Wrong category with Dick Morris.”

    Well, on that we agree. “Condi vs. Hillary” remains one of the funniest things ever to me.

    As for the polls, only SurveyUSA did polling on the VP debate (in OH, FL, CA, and WA). The results in CA were predictable for Biden, but OH was split and WA and FL went for Biden. That is ultimately not good for McCain, especially with Obama resurgent in Florida – especially if the Great Schlep pays off.

    “and we’re in how many entangling engagements now?”

    And if we’re going to strict constitutionality on those (regardless of motive) which side was Obama on (at least in Iraq – even I supported the war in Afghanistan to kill [preferably capture] bin Laden).

    “If Pakistan doesn’t like it, too frikken bad. They’re starting to look an awful lot like the Taliban in hindering us from killing bin Laden.”

    Which again, is the Obama position (and Palin’s too – correctly – until Daddy took her to the woodshed).

    “As for Iran, they simply cannot be allowed to have the bomb. Sorry, yes, it IS an exclusive club, and the certifiably insane are not allowed to have nuclear weapons.”

    And again, no disagreement.

    “I think we could quite easily bring that country to its knees by doing what we did to Iraq in the first Gulf War:”

    You don’t know enough Iranians – Iranians aren’t Iraq. Iraq has far too much Gulfie influence.

    “Yeah, yeah, I’m a big, mean, nasty, bloody hawk. Cry me a river.”

    Which has never been the US position. Jefferson may have gone after the Barbary Pirates, but he did so under the aegis of cooperation with the European powers. We don’t live on planet America we live on an increasingly shrinking Earth with a nation dying to have a reason to step onto the world stage – you don’t think China would happily jump into the fray to create a new Sino-dominated Middle East?

    ” Biden should have known better. If he didn’t know that…what else doesn’t he know about the Constitution?”

    You’re fighting perception. America hates Dick Cheney – Palin saying she wanted to step into his shoes? Joe Six-pack (and hey, how’d everyone love that bit of marginalization?) no likely.

  35. I stopped reading comments by “Anti-federalist” when he called for the execution of RINO’s on another post.

  36. Antifederalist says

    I couldn’t care less about your opinion. Wallow in ignorance. That neo-cons, RINOs, and moderates are the downfall of this country is so evident that to argue otherwise is to bury your head in the sand. To defend them is to aid their treachery.

  37. Antifederalist,
    I think what would have been the best strategy would have been to accept the Taliban’s deal to turn bin Laden over for commitment not to invade. But hey, I guess it is easier to just invade a country and then you can do whatever you want. Piece of cake, right?

    As to entangling alliances in the Middle East – here is something to look at. We are sending billions of dollars in military aid and weapons systems to Israel. This same country has 200-300 nuclear warheads, some of which are on US made cruise missiles deployed on submarines sitting in the Persian gulf and Gulf of Oman.

  38. Thank you, Anti-Federalist. You’ve put me in my place. You’ve tried me, and found me guilty of ignorance. Now you can toss me in your mass grave with the rhinos, neo cons and moderates, along with, I assume, liberals, socialists, Democrats…. Have I missed anyone? That way, my head will truly be buried in the sand. Go take your meds.

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