A controversy seems to have come up among conservatives and pro-liberty activists in Arizona regarding Senator Pearce’s anti-illegal immigration bill, SB1070.
I received this nastygram on my windshield at last Thursday’s big teaparty in Tempe.
So, Naturally, I looked into it.
I found that this amendment had been added to Russell Pearce’s anti-illegal immigration bill, SB1070.
“D. Nothing in this act shall implement or shall be construed or interpreted to implement or establish the REAL ID act of 2005 (P.L. 109-13, division B; 119 Stat. 302) including the use of a radio frequency identification chip.”
However, I also found that this group, the Arizona Campaign for Liberty, is unconcerned about any REAL ID ramifications and specifically pointed out another section of the bill: E. E1 and E2, in SB1070, which states:
- E. Except as provided in federal law, officials or agencies of this state and counties, cities, towns and other political subdivisions of this state may not be prohibited or in any way be restricted from sending, receiving or maintaining information relating to the immigration status, lawful or unlawful, of any individual or exchanging that information with any other federal, state or local governmental entity for the following official purposes:
- 1. Determining eligibility for any public benefit, service or license provided by any federal, state, local or other political subdivision of this state.
- 2. Verifying any claim of residence or domicile if determination of residence or domicile is required under the laws of this state or a judicial order issued pursuant to a civil or criminal proceeding in this state.
Campaign for Liberty asserts that this language
…allows any state agency or political subdivision to hand over to the US Department of Homeland Security any data on any person for any license.
The Campaign for Liberty states it is not against the anti-illegal immigration measures in the bill, just this part of the bill. The Campaign for Liberty also states that:
…this means that DPS can hand over your CCW data, the Motor Vehicle Division can hand over your drivers license data and Game and Fish can hand over your hunting license data to the US Department of Homeland Security or any federal department or agency.
Does this part of the bill create a national id? Analysis:
It appears that the Campaign for Liberty is correct, based on the reading of the language of the bill. There is nothing that prohibits any state agency from “exchanging” any data from any person (legal or illegal) with the US Department of Homeland Security (or any other federal department or agency) when investigating an applicant for any license (or benefit).
It’s pretty clear that “any state agency” includes the agencies (or political subdivisions mentioned above). It’s pretty clear that any person means any person. It’s also pretty clear that any license includes drivers or hunting licenses. “Shall not be prohibited” is a stronger version of “is allowed to”. Does “any license” also include CCW? I don’t know.
So does this in itself create a national id? No. But after the federal government obtains the information from Arizona state agencies, nothing stops the feds from integrating it with all the other data they have on you and from the federal government creating a national id database out of it.
It should be noted that the “Revolution” flyer does not appear to be from the Campaign for Liberty, but from this other group.
Personally, I am vehemently opposed to national id efforts of any kind (for any reason) on spiritual grounds. I also oppose it on historical grounds. National ids were part of the Clintonista agenda of the early 90s. Conservatives opposed it at the time on the grounds of internal passports had only ever been used by totalitarian and communist governments.
Ronald Reagan was also against national ids. http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa237.html
I’m really concerned about SB1070. It is simply not worth risking the liberty and privacy of law abiding Arizonans and handing over their data to the feds. Why can’t Arizona do what Oklahoma is doing? Apparently, the very same anti-illegal immigrations efforts are underway in Oklahoma, but the Oklahoma state legislature has figured out a way of doing the same thing without turning over the private data of law abiding Oklahomans to Obama and the US Department of Homeland Security:
http://axiomamuse.wordpress.com/2010/01/24/mark-lerner-on-the-power-hour-jan-25-from-8-9am-cst/
The arguments that the Campaign for Liberty make are compelling. If I were a conservative legislator posed with voting on this bill, I’d make sure that I read it first and asked some tough questions about why the privacy of law abiding Arizonans is being sacrificed to Obama (incl. CCW permit info?!?) when Oklahoma has figured out how to do the same thing without sacrificing law abiding Oklahomans’ data.
Here’s another little interesting tidbit…… It appears that our friends to the north are concerned about the same thing in Nevada. More interesting, it appears like the vote on entering Nevada into the REAL ID program is occurring on the same day(!) that the Arizona State Legislature is voting on roughly the equivalent in Arizona.
http://gonv.org/blog/2010/04/18/stop-real-id/
http://www.nevadafamilies.org/RealID.htm
Also Gun Owners of America states that once the federal government has your drivers license data, they have enough information to track gun purchases!!!
“Since I need a driver’s license to purchase a gun from a dealer, BATFE would finally have its long-coveted tool to impose gun control on targeted groups — particularly under a liberal anti-gun administration. If you believe in the Second Amendment, please vote against this anti-gun monstrosity.” http://seclists.org/politech/2005/Feb/0016.html
Gun Owners of America clearly is against providing law abiding citizens data to the federal government.
Based on GOA’s assessment above and the fact that the Arizona MVD can voluntarily hand over your drivers license data to the feds (DPS and CCW data too?), could SB1070 inadvertently lead to gun registration?
The risk here is too great. In our rush to pass strict anti-illegal immigration measures, have we not paid attention to the greater concern? Protecting our state sovereignity and our individual independence from the federal government?
Does the legislature know what it’s doing? I’m not sure it does.
Is the fringe “revolution” group who produced the flyer right? If you take out the personal invectives and just focus on the facts, it looks like they are.
I’m impressed. I thought this was going to be another in a long line of posts on this site bashing illegals and supporting the encroaching statism of Russell Pearce and Joe Arpaio. Instead the author actually looked at the facts and came to the conclusion that the potential loss of personal liberties in SB1070 is not worth the alleged benefits of the bill.
Hopefully members of the legislature and the voting public will take an equally careful look at the hidden aspects of Pearce’s power play.
read the attached “legal opinion”; I also have one from County Attorney’s Office making it clear, the issues raised by these folks are simply not true. NOT TRUE!!! However, they would continue to allow this Republic to be destroyed,citizens to killed and maimed, billions to educate, medicate and incarcerate, jobs taken from Americans as they refuse to read the bill. There is NO new ID requirements in the bill at all, it simply takes the handcuffs off from law enforcement and makes sure they can ask. I have never seen such mis-information put out by anyone. So the do not believe me, Maricopa County Attorney’s Office, attorneys at Legislative Council, Rep. Andy Biggs, Kris Kobach with FAIR the #1 attoney in the nation on this issue, I am out of words for them. I have fought my entire life for states soveriegnty and Constitutional liberties, I am amazed.
From: Republican Communications
Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2010 9:39 PM
To: 13 Timothy Schwartz – EGC
Subject: SB10170
To: MCRC Republicans
From: Exec. Dir. Tom Husband
Reg: SB1070
Message from Sen. Russell Pearce: Also see attachment for letter from the County Attorney’s office.
Date: Friday, April 16, 2010,
Dear Friends and fellow Patriots;
We are just days away of removing the handcuffs from law enforcement and allowing them enforcing our laws. SB1070 passed out of the House with 35 votes (all Republicans) and now must be voted on again in the Senate to accept the House amendments (those were my amendments under Rep. Biggs name). I worked very dilligently with those with any legitimate concerns.
NO ONE fights any harder for freedom and limited government than I do. Our laws must be enforced, our borders must be secured and citizens have a Constitutional right to this protection under our laws and our Constitution.
I have two legal opinions which are contained here. However, in spite of this, some folks continue to promote concerns that are not in the bill and are already prohibited by law. However, I had Rep. Andy Biggs amend the bill in the House to make it even more clear. I have spent several hours working with Governor’s Office, F.A.I.R. and others to make it even clearer. I have prohibiting a form of National ID or radio chip of any kind as indicated in the Obama plan for new ID. I also have strengthened the civil rights provision in the bill. I have strengthened other areas of concern to insure those not promoting the furtherance of an illegal alien remaining in the U.S. is not at risk for just giving a ride to them for legal activities, like church an scouts. I added language to make sure the exchange of information is about aliens is only the ability to communicate with each other and not a exchange of data base. I added an exemption for emergency transportation, etc.
Some of those folks that have expressed concerns are open border folks, anarchist and have fought me on any and every effort to stop enforcement of our laws.
SB1070 is the most comprehensive enforcement bill in the nation, it will remove all “illegal” sanctuary policies that limit or prevent law enforcement from asking and investigating that exist in many of our cities, and it will allow law enforcement the discretion to enforce our immigration laws as intended. Other states are anxious to follow our lead.
I guarantee this will save American jobs, reduce the cost of government, improve neighborhood safety, improve congestion, move toward smaller classrooms, shorter lines in emergency rooms, reduce rapes and molestations and reduce the number of deaths and maimings of our citizens and more. Please note that Phoenix has had a more than 50% reduction in homicides this year over last, after we passed employer sanctions and other illegal alien legislation, and our illegal alien population has decreased by twice the national average in the past two years. SB1070 will add a “trespass” provision to law enforcement giving them the ability to hold an illegal alien under state law if need be or to just call ICE and turn them over to ICE. This provision will allow our law enforcement folks to complete investigations on a suspect and not allow them to be deported before the investigation can be completed. It also goes after illegal employers and illegal aliens soliciting work and provides for law enforcement to more easily enforce public safety issues on busy streets.
I have worked for over 30 years to protect states sovereignty, our Constitutional liberties and in defense of our Republic as intended by our Founding Fathers.
I want to make sure my good friends that have expressed concerns have those concerns eliminated on this bill before we move it to the Governor for signature. I have had several people call with concerns over issues/language that I firmly believe is not in this legislation. To be sure, I have asked for additional legal opinions and have been assured by several competent independent Constitutional attorneys, legislative council attorneys and the Maricopa County Attorney’s Office that my interpretation is correct.
We have already passed legislation to prohibit the State of Arizona from participation in any kind of National ID or Real ID Act. It is the law today and will remain the law. This bill did not and does not change that. Having said that, I will put language in the bill that enhances the clarity on these issues of concern and make it very clear that nothing in this bill will allow Arizona to be a part of any national ID program. There will be similar language to deal with concerns over improper or prolonged detention. I have had Legislative Council and the Maricopa County Attorney’s Office examine this legislation and both have assured me it does not allow for any kind of National ID or expand ID requirements in any way. I have also attached the letter from the MCAO that answered my questions. I am also pasting the legal opinion from the Arizona Legislative Council at the bottom of this email.
Finally, the Governor’s Office is working with me on this legislation to make sure it protects civil liberties, but allows law enforcement to enforce the law.
I will keep you appraised on our progress.
ARIZONA LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL
(legal opinion); Second one in attachment.
A.R.S. section 11-1051, subsections B through E essentially empowers state agencies and employees with law enforcement authority to determine the status of illegal aliens, transfer aliens already determined to exist in the United States illegally to federal custody and arrest anyone believed to have engaged in an offense warranting legal removal from the United States. The bill section does not grant authority, either explicitly or implicitly, to detain a person indefinitely.
A.R.S. section 11-1051 states well established legal concept in the context of immigration enforcement; however, there are a few points worth noting. Subsection B allows a law enforcement entity, where reasonable suspicion exists, to presumably detain a suspected illegal alien for the purpose of determining immigration status. This is simply a restatement of the federal law already in place. See Brown v. Texas, 443 U.S. 47 (1979); see also Ramirez v. Webb, 719 F.Supp. 610, 616 (W.D. Mich. 1989) (holding that law enforcement authorities “may detain an individual for a brief period of interrogation here the circumstances create a reasonable suspicion that the individual is engaged in illegal activity. In this case, the relevant illegal activity is that the individual is illegally present in this country.”). There is nothing in this subsection that would permit a law enforcement entity to go beyond this allowance and indefinitely detain someone.
Subsection E provides that a law enforcement officer “may arrest a person if the officer has probable cause to believe that the person has committed any public offense that makes the person removable from the United States.” Again, as with subsection B, this is simply a restatement of the established constitutional protections and does not go so far as to permit indefinite detention. See Atwater v. City of Lago Vista, 532 U.S. 318, 354 (2001) (holding that “[i]f an officer has probable cause to believe that an individual has committed even a very minor criminal offense in his presence, he may, without violating the Fourth Amendment, arrest the offender.”).
Subsection C requires the immediate transfer of an illegal alien to federal custody once state sanctions expire. Subsection D allows a law enforcement agency to transport an illegal alien in the agency’s custody to a federal facility at other points in the process.
Neither subsection authorizes indefinite detention.
The other issue presented in this memorandum focuses on whether A.R.S. section 11-1051 functionally implements the REAL ID Act of 2005 (“RIDA”). The bill would not implement RIDA. RIDA states that “a Federal agency may not accept, for any official purpose, a driver’s license or identification card issued by a State to any person unless the State is meeting the requirements of this section.” Further, RIDA states that the Secretary of Homeland Security “may make grants to a State to assist the State in conforming to the minimum standards set forth in this title.” Other than allowing the Secretary to make grants to assist states in conforming to the minimum standards, it is an all or nothing policy: a state either conforms or it is in violation of the Act.
The fact that A.R.S. section 11-1051 allows for the sending, receiving, maintaining or exchanging of immigration status information with any federal, state or local agency does not in any way invoke the application of RIDA in Arizona. Arizona, If a law enforcement entity did detain a person indefinitely, it would violate federal and constitutional law. There is nothing in A.R.S. section 11-1051 that attempts to override these federally mandated procedural protections.
Pursuant to federal and state law currently in place, could easy exchange information with any federal entity and maintain its “sovereignty” with regard to RIDA.
Finally, A.R.S. section 11-1051 narrowly restricts when a public agent can access status related information. Subsection F states four limiting “official purposes.” If a public agent or bureaucrat cannot demonstrate that he accessed a person’s information pursuant to subsections F’s official purposes, that agent would not find asylum in section 11-1051. This subsection is apparently causing some people confusion, because they are reading the paragraphs as a new requirement for governmental entities to seek information. SB 1070 does not create new mandates to seek information. These paragraphs must be read with the whole subsection. They limit the purposes for which immigration status information may be exchanged.
CONCLUSIONS
A.R.S. section 11-1051 does not allow for the indefinite detention of an individual. A.R.S. section 11-1051 is not a de facto implementation of the REAL ID Act of 2005. A.R.S. section 11-1051 limits access to information to four narrowly constructed official purposes.
Hmm… Subsection E provides for a lot more than just what the legal opinion states. That part of your bill is right in the SA post word for word. It’s plain as day what it says and what it means. Anyone can read it for themselves.
R EVOL UTION is Ron Paul’s “outfit” isn’t it?
They have a bad habit of spamming polls and the like. So, it’s definitely correct to take a VERY close look at their claims.
I couldn’t be more against national IDs, so I re-read the points in question. However, I don’t come to the same conclusion or doubt. The bill is very specific about it’s target: unlawful status in the state, unlawfully acquiring public services, and transporting individuals who are in the state unlawfully. There is too little credit given to the clarity in section E which specifies that, “this state may not be prohibited or in any way be restricted from sending, receiving or maintaining information RELATING TO IMMIGRATION STATUS.” As I understand it, some municipalities preclude transmitting or acquiring immigration status. That would clearly be wrong in the case of granting business licenses, drivers licenses, public services, etc. Section E expands to enumerate specific conditions for which the exchange of immigration status shall not be prohibited.
Senator Pearce indicated that amendments were still being considered, however, this section doesn’t present the threat to gun rights as claimed. I fully support SB1070, and I very much appreciate all the scrutiny it’s getting.
Secondly, the cash for clunkers, even cash for refrigerators program, were greater threats to privacy and liberty than this bill, yet state residents participated in those without abandon. I can only imagine just how much personal information is already transmitted from state to federal government? Driver’s license data is already publicly available for many Americans and they don’t even know it. This bill makes it lawful in Arizona to transmit immigration status to conduct specific business with the State. I don’t see any abridgment to my second amendment rights as a result, but I do see a deterrent to crippling illegal immigration.
R EVOL UTION is Ron Paul’s “outfit” isn’t it?
___
Yes
Thank you Jane. Its refreshing to hear a clear thinking individual.
I was dismayed that this article was even posted here. It seems that the individual responsible for this has been drinking the same kool-aid as fringe candidates such as Bruce Olsen and Jim Deakin.
No reasonable person wants a National ID Card. I don’t believe Senator Pearce does.
I believe, but have no proof, that Homeland Security already has this information (and some) about the citizens of the US. It is too late to cry over spilled milk. It is the post 911 era, with security comes a loss of privacy.
Here is where I agree with Paulies. There are unintended consequences with this bill.
Take away all the legal jargon and it comes down to the cop on the street and the citizen (or not). How exactly does one determine citizenship if one won’t take the suspect’s word for it ? Ah yes..papers please. You must prove you are innocent. Just think about that for a bit..
I’m required by law to carry around certain “papers” when I get in my car. Legal immigrants have similar requirements. When I registered my child for school, I needed “papers.” If we aren’t going to cry over spilled milk, the “papers please” scenario sure is pedantic. Should law enforcement take your word for it when after bending a few light poles, you claim not to be drunk? Does the bank take your word for it when you ask the teller for cash? Do people seriously think the White House is going to curb illegal immigration or address related problems? And, wouldn’t today’s federal government be far more invasive and restrictive. Instead, let’s have a reasonable look at “unintended consequences” when states do nothing.
Campaign for Liberty is Ron Paul’s outfit and is a non-partisan non-profit.
http://www.campaignforliberty.com
“Revolution” is these people
httP://www.freedomsphoenix.com
“This bill is very specific as to its target.”
No, it’s not. Just as the author of the post points out and actually includes the actual words of the bill!
Section E says ANY PERSON, legal or illegal.
Since when does any person only mean some people and not others.
Any person is ANY PERSON.
Duh. What’s wrong with you?
The Kool-Aid drinkers are up to their usual garbage. This is the first time I have come to SA in months for just this reason. The site was founded to present conservative, pro-life, pro-second amendment, smaller government positions and has turned into a mouthpiece for zealots who actually destroy those issues. I will not be back for awhile.
I think Mr. Pearce wants us to believe that if you aren’t a Mexican, you have nothing to worry about.
I, for one, am tired of having my liberties stripped away.
Someone help me out here..I am just asking the question..not judging…
In plain English..
1) A person is this in this country without proper documentation or authority.
2) In Arizona, this person is committing a criminal act, essentially trespassing..
3) A law enforcement officer may stop and detain and request papers from a person for no other reason than they suspect the person is committing the crime of trespassing.
How does this not lead to profiling and roadblocks ? In the right hands the new law can be a powerful tool, in the wrong hands it is one step closer to a police state.
I think the big difference between this law and existing federal immigration laws is that INS combs the border and certain inland highways for suspected trespassers, whereas local law enforcement will comb our neighborhoods.
Am I off-base here ?
If the state sends data to the feds before issuing licenses, etc., the state may be limiting itself to using that data for immigration enforcement, but it doesn’t limit how the feds use that data. So saying that the data transmission is for a limited purpose doesn’t hold much weight. Arizona law can’t restrict the feds.
Also, the part of the bill that states that police:
“may arrest a person if the officer has probable cause to believe that the person has committed any public offense that makes the person removable from the United States”
would cover legal immigrants as well as illegal ones. It doesn’t say that the officer has probable cause to believe that the person is illegally in the country or has been issued a deportation order. It says that probable cause that they have done something that would make them “removable”. That is absurdly broad and gives way to much power to the local police over immigrants who are here legally. Whether any given offense might make someone removable or not should only be at the determination of an immigration judge not a local police officer.
1st red flag
why do the police need an indemnity clause in this bill?
Oberserve Says:
April 19th, 2010 at 4:48 am
Campaign for Liberty is Ron Paul’s outfit and is a non-partisan non-profit.
http://www.campaignforliberty.com
“Revolution” is these people
httP://www.freedomsphoenix.com
……
They have been ostensibly supporting Ron Paul, so there’s some linkage – more than just casual. “Cynical” comes to mind.
I want to know more about how Oklahoma solved this problem. If they were able to implement the same thing as SB1070, but protect the data of its citizens.
That’s the way to go!
Why can’t Senator Pearce look into what Oklahoma is doing?
This video explains Russel Pearce’s law enforcement Amnesty bill http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eV3of0vSVzM
We need enforcement NOW!
Road blocks to find all illegals!
Stop everyone, also check for concealed guns (oops, now legal in az), tax evaders (i have to pay – they should too) and I guess health insurance -thats federal law not too isnt it? I guess we need to not enforce all fed laws, just the ones we like.
I don’t think anyone here is against enforcement or against the anti-illegal immigration measures.
But there’s no reason to turnover Arizonans private data to the feds in the process.
This is bad lawmaking. We cannot afford to, nor should we focus on, what is clearly a Federal issue. This offers authority rife with potential for abuse, a method for deprivation of individual liberties and a move toward authoritarian control.
Fascism is an effort to gain political power that plays on people’s fears of change and supposed chaos, and general insecurity. It appeals to nationalist sentiments and prejudices, and portrays itself as champions of law, order, morality, and the sanctity of private property. Fascists resist autonomy of cultural or ethnic groups who refuse to or are unable to assimilate. They consider social autonomy as a threat.
See any similarities?
Sounds like the same arguments people that stand around passively watching a murder, rape or other crime make.
Our people are being killed and attacked while the feds just sit there. Illegal is not a race, it’s a crime.
The bill passed get use to it!
Does anyone else expect to see some localities setting up immigration checkpoints just like they have sobriety checkpoints? I do. Then we can all be treated to this sort of thing – http://bit.ly/cyqRJf
Pearce,
This bill will take away resources from real police work and you know it. Yes-we have read the bill. It’s time for you to stop your campaign of misinformation.
You’ve helped put convicted DUI offenders back on our streets when you worked for DMV, you proudly forwarded white supremacist emails to hundreds and you also continued to support JT Ready several months after he was publicly exposed as a neo-Nazi at an OPEN LEGISLATIVE SESSION.
You’ve done absolutely nothing to help the economy in AZ. You may intimidate AZ politicians but you don’t intimidate me.
You’re statistics have been either 100% wrong or completely unprovable on this bill. Using lobbyists who will financially profit from this bill like Kris Kobach or FAIR as your experts is ridiculous and ignorant. Name calling on National tv (I’m referring to you calling those that don’t agree with you Anarchists, wimpy liberals, open border advocates, etc…) Leaves you wide open to start explaining yourself, your neo-Nazi ties, your corrupt illegal behavior with the DMV and your well documented wife beating. If this blog would like-I’ll be most happy to show the public records. Unlike your fake stats-I’ve got the proof!
You may have bullied some into passing this but it’s not over by a long shot. In fact the fight has only begun.
Now that its a crime for illegal aliens to be in Arizona, does that mean I can arrest them using the powers of CITIZENS ARREST? If not, then this law is useless becausde it wio
We need RETROACTIVE abolition of birthright citizenship to all persons born on US soil to illegal alien parents. Coupled with explicit laws guaranteeing Americans the right to make CITIZENS ARREST of illegal aliens, wevcan begin to TAKE BACK our country from these cockroaches!
Abolish birthright citizenship RETROACTIVELY and allow Americans to make citizens arrest of illegal aliens and I guarantee you patriots will step up and make ALL (100%) of illegal aliens are back in mexico (where they belong!) within 30 days!
GET OUT!!!
Every dead cop defending your right to be an idiot take resources away from law enforcement.
Death and maimings of police officers and citizens in Arizona by illegal aliens
“Rob” Krentz
Phoenix Officer Shane Figueroa (killed)
Phoenix Officer Nick Erfle (Murdered)
Phoenix Office Glidewell (shot in chest)
Child serial rapist in Chandler
15 year old raped in Scottsdale by school janitor
15 year old kidnapped and raped in Guadalupe
Phoenix Officer Marc Atkinson (murdered)
Phoenix Officer Robert Sitek (murdered)
Kris Eggle-park ranger in southern Arizona (murdered)
Border Patrol Agent James Epling (murdered)
Deputy Sean Pearce (shot by homicide suspects)
Deputy Lew Argetsinger (shot my homicide suspects)
Sgt. Manuel H. Tapia was shot by a drug suspect
DPS Officer Robert K. Martin, 57, was shot to death – his assailant, Ernesto Salgado Martinez, a 19-year-old ex-convict
Agent Richard Fass, 37, of the United States Drug Enforcement Agency, murdered
Agent Alexander Kirpnick, 27, Border Patrol, murdered
Jason Schechterle suffered fourth-degree burns when his patrol care went up in flames after being struck by a taxi – the driver was an illegal alien.
Gilbert mother killed by illegal alien fleeing from police in Mesa
Jason, Decorated Iraq war veteran stabbed in his own front yard by illegal alien
Mother “legal immigrant” killed by illegal alien trying to ram Sheriff’s Deputy’s car in Phoenix
Tracy “17 year old” killed by drunk illegal alien
Study: 1 million sex crime victims by illegals More than 100 sex predators crossing border daily
Deborah Schurman-Kauflin: Based on a one-year in-depth study, a researcher estimates there are about 240,000 illegal immigrant sex offenders in the United States who have had an average of four victims each.
Deborah Schurman-Kauflin of the Violent Crimes Institute in Atlanta analyzed 1,500 cases from January 1999 through April 2006 that included serial rapes, serial murders, sexual homicides and child molestation committed by illegal immigrants.
According to border patrol 1 out 10 illegal aliens crossing the border already have a felony conviction. 30% of federal prisoners are illegal aliens for serious crimes.
Over 50% of homicides in Phoenix involve illegal aliens.
Phoenix #2 in the world in kidnappings.
Most offenders were in states with the highest numbers of illegal immigrants. California had the most offenders, followed by Texas, Arizona, New Jersey, New York and Florida.
I will gladly submit to any and all request for documents proving legal immigration status and I am expecting it because I am of mexican decent. It is a small price to pay for a safer place to live.
Well stated Jason! I travel to Europe for business and pleasure. I always need my passport and papers to show I can legally work in whatever country I’m in at the time. It changes depending on where I’m working and how long, but I always need them.
I guess being a real true conservative now means submitting to a police state.
The founding fathers disagree with Jason.
Benajmin Franklin said:
“Those who give up their liberty for more security neither deserve liberty nor security. ”
I hate to say it, but I believe that Benjamin Franklin knows more about liberty and the loss of it than Jason does.
Jason is not a reliable source of pro-liberty, pro-constitution information.
Blue Meanie,
The difference between the European socialist states (east and west) and the United States was that in the US, US citizens are not tracked and tracked by their own federal government, nor subject to monitoring or display of their papers or identity unless suspected or charged with a crime.
It’s pretty sad to see a conservative want the US to be more like Europe.
Maybe you’re not a real conservative. That’s my guess.
Oberserve,
I’m tired of paying for lawbreakers and watching U.S. citizens victimized. I’m tired of dead cops. I’m tired of U.S. soldiers defending this country abroad only to be murdered in their from yards by illegal aliens. The results at the voting both indicate most people agree with me.
Maybe you’re not a real U.S. citizen. That’s my guess.
Dennis Gilman is a liar,
You people just can’t get your facts straight or even bother to get reputable information.
“Deborah Schurman-Kauflin:”
Pulls the same trick Rep. King does – takes a percentage of undocumented immigrants in federal custody and extrapolates to the general population of undocumented immigrants – this is a completely bogus ‘statistic.’
“30% of federal prisoners are illegal aliens for serious crimes.”
No, that is wrong. 26-27% of people held in federal prison on non-citizens. They are not even close to all undocumented immigrant nor being held for ‘serious crimes.’
“Over 50% of homicides in Phoenix involve illegal aliens.”
Post a link or source. You won’t because there is none.
“According to border patrol 1 out 10 illegal aliens crossing the border already have a felony conviction”
Oh yeah, where does the Border Patrol say this? Post a link.
Blue Meanie,
I’m tired of it too. There’s just this little thing called my freedom and the US Constitution in the way of your emotions.
Personally, I hold them in much higher regard than your hysteria.
Immigration control needs to occur, but not at the price of my liberty and freedom.
And if you are the one asserting that I need to lose some liberty and freedom in order for it to happen, then you hate the founding fathers of this nation.
Oberserve,
despite the lies of many, there is nothing in this bill that takes away from any freedom in the constitution. Written legal opinions from two respectable sources confirm this statement. Drape yourself in the flag all you want, people aren’t buy it and vote overwhelmingly for stronger enforcement. Every republican in both the house and senate voted for this bill. There are no black helicopters or agents lurking in the shadows. It’s your paranoia and emotions that prevent you from understanding.
And this is where the tea-party comes apart at the seems.
The whole concept is less government intrusion, not more.
Think of it this way…
Substitute the word “domestic terrorist” for “illegal alien”.
Now give law enforcement the same blank check to pull over anyone suspected of being a domestic terrorist. A gun owner, a tea party member, a known protestor, a blogger.
How about that ?
“seams” sorry for the typo
“And this is where the tea-party comes apart at the seems.”
I have been hearing it called the Paul/Palin split. However, those two groups have seems to coexist for a long time together so I’m not really anticipating a real fracture – at least not until/unless things go more south for the GOP.
News flash kids: Chris Kobash is not a well respected legal expert.
He stands to profit greatly from this bill. Why do you think he helped write it?
He already raped the Tax Payers of Maricopa County for bogus training at a rate of 300/hour while hours are cut and Sheriff Deputies can’t get decent raises.
This is dirty politics where a few will make lots of money at the tax payers expense. It was deliberately written that way and Pearce knows it. Is this what republicans are really all about?
Is that what the tea party stands for?
Everything I said about Pearce is 100 % accurate and easily proven with court documents. Both his ex and current wife have complaimed of phisical abuse and violence. He was fired from the DMV for forging an ID so he could help put a DUI offender back on the streets. More people are killed every year by DUI’s commited by stupid white drunks then the entire undocumented population committing any crime put together and multipled by 5.
Here are a few simple facts:
Immigrants regardless of there legal status are the least likely group to commit crimes. You can copy/paste off some hate site all you want. The fact is that murders dropped greater then 1/2 durring the years that illegal immigration grew at its largest. (FBI, DOJ)
There is absolutely nothing you can say or do to change that simple and undisputable fact.
The problem seems a bit over the heads of those that perhaps aren’t even aware of how racist they’ve become: Immigration is a social and economice issue. It’s not a crime issue.
When a white male kills someone do you blame the gun or the person? His race? His sex? I’m guessing you blame the person.
Any gun enthuesiest should be able to figure it out. I understand how upset you get when people want to ban guns because of stupid white guys murdering. Can’t you see the hpyocracy to blame those that do not brake laws (minus the misdomeaner offences of crossing the border without papers or overstaying a visa)
You can seal that border as tight as you want-the US wiill still buy the drugs, and the real bad guys will surely come. And our NRA fans will surely make certain those drug dealers in Mexico have the best American guns drug money can buy.
This bill will destroy AZ. The 30% of Hispanic voters are already talking about a National bouycott of AZ. as is Mexico (our number one trade partner) Pearce thinks our economy will maigically heal after this is passed? Look at the track record of the Employer Sancions law: Businesses left or never came. We were way ahead of the recision.
Yet when we were seeing our best years-we were not chasing Gardeners and cooks.
Can someone please tell me one thing Pearce has ever done to improve our economy? I didn’t think so.
Additionally, Pearce should be ashamed of himself exploiting the death of the rancher when his facist law will do absolutely nothing to secure the border from criminals or organized crime-in fact it will increase. Furthermore, exploiting the death of Officer Erfle after the kind things his wife has to say and her support for Phil Gordon’s views on immigration only show the desperate pettyness of Pearce. YOU DO NOT SPEAK FOR HER PEARCE!
Pearce claims he’s against big Government but this bill will increase government and without any way to pay for the added cost in incarceration and duties of our Law Enforcement. Why do you think the police chiefs are against it? They have a larger responsability to the communities then PLEA officers do. Hunting brown is way easier then solving real crime. Currently 50% of all murders in AZ go unsolved. We already lack the resources.
After you finish completely destroying the economy in AZ (and you will) you will realize that the only winners with this bill will be Pearces pals at FAIR who will flood this state so they can start
collecting lawsuits at the Tax Payers expense because Pearce deliberately wrote this bill so racist goons can could sue almost anyone who they feel isn’t enforcing this insane law.
And Nightcrawler is also correct. This law will turn AZ into a Police State. We are going down a very dark and unAmerican road.
This is Nazi Germany 1930′s all over again.
………………..
“You can seal that border as tight as you want-the US wiill still buy the drugs, and the real bad guys will surely come. And our NRA fans will surely make certain those drug dealers in Mexico have the best American guns drug money can buy.
………….
Sounds like a bad case of ethnocentrism to me. THe world does not actually revolve around the USA. Mexico buys guns from all sorts of suppliers off the international market. They have zero need to go to the USA for that. Why drag the NRA into something it has nothing to do with?
ANd how come there is all this “Save the Rainforest” and “Boycott this company to Save the … fuzzy seal babies” and “Save the Planet, use CFC bulbs” and “Boycott Japan for Whaling,” but no “DIE-INs” of caring people strewn artfully across main avenues to raise awareness of illegal drug abuse in AMerica, yet all these boycott THIS and boycott THAT, but where oh where are the calls to boycott ILLEGAL DRUGS?
Where are the naked actresses? The anarchists climbing up drug cartel office buildings? Code PINK chasing after drug lords to handcuff them by citizen’s arrest?
Leftists infiltrating drug conferences to disrupt and discredit them?
What what? Where’s the outrage that poor village downtrodden peasants are used and abused like slaves by the heartless drug cartels, who murder and corrupt their way thru drug-sales-financed life?
Pearce is sold out to a Papers Please state. He does not protect liberty from government. He promotes government indemnity and ‘liberty’ to do whatever they want when in “Law Enforcement” mode, against everyday Americans.
Pearce is not a conservative. He is an authoritarian pretending to be one for the last 30 years,
George Washington and Thomas Jefferson quite frankly wouldn’t recognize him.
wanumba,
Here is a bit of reality for you before you straw-man my words into your own little fantasy:
The vast majority of guns that supply The Mexican Cartels are bought right here in the US. The so called open border goes both ways. Guns are one of the many things we trade with Mexico. The gun trade just happens to be illegal both in our country as well as
Mexico’s.
I shared the info so people can see how pointless Pearces bill is of solving anything other then turning AZ into a Police State and lining the pockets of his wealthy friends from FAIR.
As for a Boycott of AZ. It will effect you if you live here. You really have no clue if you think it wont. I’m not even certain if it will happen but I can tell you it’s being discussed as you butterfly about with your nonsensical blather.
Some readers may not know why Russell Pearce can’t always see straight.
______
Post #28 said:
Every dead cop defending your right to be an idiot
take resources away from law enforcement.
Death and maimings of police officers and citizens in Arizona by illegal aliens…..
Deputy Sean Pearce (shot by homicide suspects)
________
Sean is Russell Pearce’s son.
Mr Bill,
Let’s not forget young Justin. He once worked for the Motor Vehicle Division, until he got fired for making fake identification cards.
Justin was convicted of a felony charge of tampering with a public record.
Justin then got a job as a tow truck driver with Cactus Towing. When DPS was going to end their contract with Cactus Towing, Representative Russell Pearce sent a letter to the DPS director objecting to the DPS plan to end the contract.
Justin Pearce (ID maker, tow truck driver)
Justin is Russell Pearce’s son.
The SA poster put the actual words of the bill of concern into this post.
The MCSO’s legal counsel did not address the specific concern raised by this post. Therefore, it’s irrelevant.
The language in question very clearly allows the state agencies to hand over the data of any law abiding Arizonan seeking a license.
Read it for yourself. IT’s right in there. The actual language of the bill is right int he post.
As far as illegals causing crimes or shooting cops goes…..
How does turning over law abiding Arizonans drivers license, CCW and hunting license data to Homeland Security stop illegal aliens from doing these things?
My name is Mark Lerner. I am the Co-Founder of the Constitutional Alliance,a national organization of state lawmakers, groups/organizations and private citizens.
The Campaign for Liberty people are correct in their analysis.
Both the Real ID Act 2005 and the PASS ID Act call for authentication of breeder documents (birth certificates). Nearly all citizens have the United States have birth certificates.
Although we are opposed to both the Real ID Act and the PASS ID Act we do support the digitizing of birth certificates which would allow for the authentication of the birth certificate (making sure the birth certificate is authentic).
We believe each birth certificate should be numbered with the state abbreviation at the start of the numbering process. For exmaple an Arizona birth certificate would be AZ46572920475759349. Once a birth certificate is used to acquire a driver’s license it would go into the “system” as “active”. In other words a person has already used the birth certificate to obatin a driver’s license. If anyone else attempted to use the same birth certificate the “system” would alert authorities at DMV immediately. Also if a person used a birth certificate that was not authentic DMV would be alerted right away pending further investigation.
Each birth certificate would be authenticated between the issuing agency of the identification document (driver’s license) and the issuing agency or department of the birth certificate. This would be accomplished through a “hub” system controlled by the states and not the federal government.
The federal government called for such a hub system as part of the Real ID Act 2005. The hub system we support would only be a conduit for information. The hub would NOT retain any information itself.
Until and unless such a system does exist there is no assurance that a person applying for a state driver’s license is in fact a citizen or who they say they are.
It has been nearly 9 years after 9/11 and we still are not authenticating birth certificates. Senator Pearce’s legislation is a band-aid that appears to provide a soltion but it actually does not. If illegals use counterfeit breeder documents they will have driver’s licenses obtained by fraud but an unsuspecting officer will believe the person with the license is in fact a citizen.
We should stop looking to the federal government to resolve a probloem, they, the federal government created.
E-Verify was supposed to be “the answer”. As it turns out a DHS report stated that E-Verify is very accurate when a citizen’s information is being verified but when a person in our country illegally is checked, E-Verify is accurate less than 50% of the time. So much for E-Verify.
The federal governmet has failed to insure all birth certificates are digitized muchless numbered.
States can be lazy and we will all pay the cost. A hub system must be put in place. If the federal government and states put as much empahasis on insuring the hub system and digitizing of birth certificates was accomplished as they did collecting our personal information the system would already be up and running.
There are no short cuts for security or addressing the illegal immigration problem.
Although Senator Pearce’s bil does NOT create a national identification card it does allow for the centralization of all citizen’s personal information with DHS creating a centralized database controlled by DHS.
The hub itself could be put in place in a little over a year. A small proce to pay to have a much more effective system that what Senator Pearce’s legislation calls for. What is needed is a sense of urgency by the states to digitize and number birth certificates.
Our solution is long term and practically foolproof. Most important of all is the states control our information, not the federal government. Only states would be involved in the authetication process. Under our solution the presumption of innocence stays in tact. There was a time in our country when we believed it was better to let 9 guilty people go than convict one innocent person.
It is the priniciples our country was founded on that has made us great. We must not let the failure of the federal government to do it’s job-protct our borders, be the reason we sacrifice the principles that do make our country the best country on earth.
Mark Lerner
Dennis Gilman Says:
April 19th, 2010 at 11:12 pm
wanumba,
Here is a bit of reality for you before you straw-man my words into your own little fantasy:
The vast majority of guns that supply The Mexican Cartels are bought right here in the US. The so called open border goes both ways. Guns are one of the many things we trade with Mexico. The gun trade just happens to be illegal both in our country as well as
Mexico’s
………
Dennis Gilman Says:
April 19th, 2010 at 11:12 pm
wanumba,
Here is a bit of reality for you before you straw-man my words into your own little fantasy:
The vast majority of guns that supply The Mexican Cartels are bought right here in the US. The so called open border goes both ways. Guns are one of the many things we trade with Mexico. The gun trade just happens to be illegal both in our country as well as
Mexico’s
…………..
SOURCES of weapons/arms seized connected with US/Mexico cross-border illegalities:
CHINA
RUSSIA
FARC – South America
MEXICAN ARMY weapons
17% of weapons sourced to USA. Yet the Left is pushing a myth of 90% sourced USA and then in a great leap of partisan political logic insinuates the innocent NRA is somehow “guilty.”
Then with pure cynicism, and massive projection, accuses anyone who calls them on it, of “strawman” tactics.
Seriously, who can really benefit by partisan enabling of criminality between Mexico and the USA, directing blame where it doesn’t belong? Isn’t it like thinking one can make a deal with the bear-trap-jawed Alien from beyond Alpha Centuri, sabotaging everyone who’s trying to survive, then getting one’s head bit off by same Alien?
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/04/02/myth-percent-small-fraction-guns-mexico-come/
“As for a Boycott of AZ. It will effect you if you live here. You really have no clue if you think it wont. I’m not even certain if it will happen but I can tell you it’s being discussed as you butterfly about with your nonsensical blather”
…….
Affect me?
Boycott … the one now being called for today by a certain Democrat congressman who seems to have forgotten or totally dissed his oath to the United States?
Bring it on. Who will stand for blackmail?
Russell Pearce and Raul Grijalva are cut from the same mold. Both favor a larger, more powerful, and intrusive government. Both are bad for Arizona.