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	<title>Comments on: Idealist?</title>
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	<description>Arizona Politics, News, Commentary and Information with a Blatantly Conservative Worldview Presented by an Alliance of Writers, Activists, Consultants and Government Insiders.</description>
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		<title>By: Richard Grayson</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-154880</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Grayson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Apr 2009 22:42:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-154880</guid>
		<description>I love that Chewie Shofir quotes Howie C. Fisher&#039;s article.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love that Chewie Shofir quotes Howie C. Fisher&#8217;s article.</p>
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		<title>By: Veritas Vincit</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-153805</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas Vincit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 02:30:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-153805</guid>
		<description>“Birther” is the accepted term for those indulging in paranoid fantasies about Obama’s citizenship

Ok, ridicule when facts don&#039;t work.

natural born Citizenship is a legal Constitutional requirement.

Your argument is, if no cop bothers to stop you from running a red light, its legal to run the red light.

I just want him to prove he&#039;s in compliance with the Constitutional requirement of the law.  You don&#039;t think it matters because, either you have no regard for our laws or, your candidate might be legally disqualified and ... well, some folks would rather let sleeping dogs lie.

don&#039;t ask don&#039;t tell right?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“Birther” is the accepted term for those indulging in paranoid fantasies about Obama’s citizenship</p>
<p>Ok, ridicule when facts don&#8217;t work.</p>
<p>natural born Citizenship is a legal Constitutional requirement.</p>
<p>Your argument is, if no cop bothers to stop you from running a red light, its legal to run the red light.</p>
<p>I just want him to prove he&#8217;s in compliance with the Constitutional requirement of the law.  You don&#8217;t think it matters because, either you have no regard for our laws or, your candidate might be legally disqualified and &#8230; well, some folks would rather let sleeping dogs lie.</p>
<p>don&#8217;t ask don&#8217;t tell right?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: The Klute</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-153304</link>
		<dc:creator>The Klute</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 15:13:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-153304</guid>
		<description>VV,

&quot;There you go again Klute, trying to obscure the focus of the question with buzz words that are not related to the question.&quot;

&quot;Birther&quot; is the accepted term for those indulging in paranoid fantasies about Obama&#039;s citizenship. It&#039;s used by Michelle Malkin&#039;s &quot;Hot Air&quot; site, and the left-wing &quot;Wonkette&quot; for instance.  You&#039;re a Birther.  Accept it.  

Again, just because you don&#039;t like the answer, doesn&#039;t make it an obfuscation.

&quot;Try to stay on focus here; Before he was elected President, how hard would it been for him to have simply released the passport he used in 1980 to travel outside the United States?&quot;

Don&#039;t know, don&#039;t care.   I don&#039;t know where my first passport is, and I&#039;ll probably discard the current one when it expires next year.  Maybe he did the same? This is about as relevant an issue to me (and I&#039;d say to the vast majority of Americans) as what kind of dog the President will choose (wait - I think more people might care about the dog). 

&quot;Again, the question remains: What passport did he use in 1980 to travel abroad? Why won’t he simply release the document?&quot;

See above for the 1st question.  As for the second question, I&#039;m hoping he&#039;s simply doing it (and not releasing the vault copy of his birth certificate) just to drive you Birthers out of your heads.  I hope there&#039;s someone right now straitjacketed in padded room rocking back and forth like a B.F. Skinner monkey muttering &quot;COLB isn&#039;t sufficient...  Must get the vault copy...&quot; over and over.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>VV,</p>
<p>&#8220;There you go again Klute, trying to obscure the focus of the question with buzz words that are not related to the question.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Birther&#8221; is the accepted term for those indulging in paranoid fantasies about Obama&#8217;s citizenship. It&#8217;s used by Michelle Malkin&#8217;s &#8220;Hot Air&#8221; site, and the left-wing &#8220;Wonkette&#8221; for instance.  You&#8217;re a Birther.  Accept it.  </p>
<p>Again, just because you don&#8217;t like the answer, doesn&#8217;t make it an obfuscation.</p>
<p>&#8220;Try to stay on focus here; Before he was elected President, how hard would it been for him to have simply released the passport he used in 1980 to travel outside the United States?&#8221;</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t know, don&#8217;t care.   I don&#8217;t know where my first passport is, and I&#8217;ll probably discard the current one when it expires next year.  Maybe he did the same? This is about as relevant an issue to me (and I&#8217;d say to the vast majority of Americans) as what kind of dog the President will choose (wait &#8211; I think more people might care about the dog). </p>
<p>&#8220;Again, the question remains: What passport did he use in 1980 to travel abroad? Why won’t he simply release the document?&#8221;</p>
<p>See above for the 1st question.  As for the second question, I&#8217;m hoping he&#8217;s simply doing it (and not releasing the vault copy of his birth certificate) just to drive you Birthers out of your heads.  I hope there&#8217;s someone right now straitjacketed in padded room rocking back and forth like a B.F. Skinner monkey muttering &#8220;COLB isn&#8217;t sufficient&#8230;  Must get the vault copy&#8230;&#8221; over and over.</p>
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		<title>By: Veritas Vincit</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-153301</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas Vincit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 14:44:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-153301</guid>
		<description>There you go again Klute, trying to obscure the focus of the question with buzz words that are not related to the question.

Try to stay on focus here; Before he was elected President, how hard would it been for him to have simply released the passport he used in 1980 to travel outside the United States?  

Again, the question remains: What passport did he use in 1980 to travel abroad?  Why won&#039;t he simply release the document?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There you go again Klute, trying to obscure the focus of the question with buzz words that are not related to the question.</p>
<p>Try to stay on focus here; Before he was elected President, how hard would it been for him to have simply released the passport he used in 1980 to travel outside the United States?  </p>
<p>Again, the question remains: What passport did he use in 1980 to travel abroad?  Why won&#8217;t he simply release the document?</p>
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		<title>By: The Klute</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-153282</link>
		<dc:creator>The Klute</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 06:55:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-153282</guid>
		<description>Because the President of the United States (who has met all citizenship requirements) has better things to do than aquiesce to the paranoid fantasies of a fringe minority.

Sorry to be so brusque, but I have as much time for Birth Certificate conspiracies than I do for people who believe the earth is flat or that the Mossad brought down the World Trade Center.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Because the President of the United States (who has met all citizenship requirements) has better things to do than aquiesce to the paranoid fantasies of a fringe minority.</p>
<p>Sorry to be so brusque, but I have as much time for Birth Certificate conspiracies than I do for people who believe the earth is flat or that the Mossad brought down the World Trade Center.</p>
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		<title>By: Veritas Vincit</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-153267</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas Vincit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 05:52:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-153267</guid>
		<description>Ok Kenny, ya got me!  You&#039;re just too easy.  Sit tight I&#039;m sure &#039;The One&#039; will be calling you any day now to appoint you to his cabinet.

Klute, like Obama you still haven&#039;t answered my original question: What passport did he carry to travel in 1980?  We&#039;d simply like to see his 1980 US passport.  How hard is that?  I still have my 1966 US passport with all its pages stamped.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok Kenny, ya got me!  You&#8217;re just too easy.  Sit tight I&#8217;m sure &#8216;The One&#8217; will be calling you any day now to appoint you to his cabinet.</p>
<p>Klute, like Obama you still haven&#8217;t answered my original question: What passport did he carry to travel in 1980?  We&#8217;d simply like to see his 1980 US passport.  How hard is that?  I still have my 1966 US passport with all its pages stamped.</p>
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		<title>By: The Klute</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-153055</link>
		<dc:creator>The Klute</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 15:54:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-153055</guid>
		<description>&quot;Klute, post #11; once again you side step the question. The question remains:

How did he get into the country when the US State Department prohibited travel there? He was a 20 year old nobody college student.&quot;

No, I answered your question, but to expound further:

One of my ex-girlfriend&#039;s family was *not* Cuban, but they went to Cuba on a fairly regular basis to go fishing. The local Cuban authorities would allow docking if they paid a &quot;administrative fee&quot;. There&#039;s always a way.

Borders, regulations, and &quot;official pronouncements&quot; equal a cup of spit to the adventurous soul.  I know the previous president and his youthful lack of inquisitiveness about places outside of the US makes our current one seem &quot;foreign&quot;, but whatever - that&#039;s your issue to work through, not mine, not America&#039;s.

Just because you don&#039;t like the answer, doesn&#039;t equal &quot;dodging the question&quot;.  

&quot;Why’s it important? Something about the Constitution’s citizenship qualification to be Commander-in-Chief.&quot;

You&#039;re a BIRTHER!?  Hi-larious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Klute, post #11; once again you side step the question. The question remains:</p>
<p>How did he get into the country when the US State Department prohibited travel there? He was a 20 year old nobody college student.&#8221;</p>
<p>No, I answered your question, but to expound further:</p>
<p>One of my ex-girlfriend&#8217;s family was *not* Cuban, but they went to Cuba on a fairly regular basis to go fishing. The local Cuban authorities would allow docking if they paid a &#8220;administrative fee&#8221;. There&#8217;s always a way.</p>
<p>Borders, regulations, and &#8220;official pronouncements&#8221; equal a cup of spit to the adventurous soul.  I know the previous president and his youthful lack of inquisitiveness about places outside of the US makes our current one seem &#8220;foreign&#8221;, but whatever &#8211; that&#8217;s your issue to work through, not mine, not America&#8217;s.</p>
<p>Just because you don&#8217;t like the answer, doesn&#8217;t equal &#8220;dodging the question&#8221;.  </p>
<p>&#8220;Why’s it important? Something about the Constitution’s citizenship qualification to be Commander-in-Chief.&#8221;</p>
<p>You&#8217;re a BIRTHER!?  Hi-larious.</p>
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		<title>By: Kenny Jacobs</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-152929</link>
		<dc:creator>Kenny Jacobs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 05:10:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-152929</guid>
		<description>Snopes.com has the rundown on the emails you lifted text from:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/money.asp
is one.
 
I don&#039;t challenge paragraphs or lines you plagiarize, I challenge you, what kind of person uploads post after post this past weekend linking to a who&#039;s-who of the far right victimization culture?

You are a hypocrite without the guts or integrity to make your paranoid induced attack under your real name. Creeps like yourself are building an underground &quot;sub-culture war.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Snopes.com has the rundown on the emails you lifted text from:<br />
<a href="http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/money.asp" rel="nofollow">http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/money.asp</a><br />
is one.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t challenge paragraphs or lines you plagiarize, I challenge you, what kind of person uploads post after post this past weekend linking to a who&#8217;s-who of the far right victimization culture?</p>
<p>You are a hypocrite without the guts or integrity to make your paranoid induced attack under your real name. Creeps like yourself are building an underground &#8220;sub-culture war.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Veritas Vincit</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-152923</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas Vincit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 04:21:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-152923</guid>
		<description>Klute, post #11; once again you side step the question.  The question remains:

How did he get into the country when the US State Department prohibited travel there?  He was a 20 year old nobody college student.

He would not have received permission to travel to Pakistan on a US passport.  In 1980 the US did not permit dual citizenship or the holding of two passports (unless you were from Israel).

We know he stayed with a friends family - how&#039;d he get passed customs and on what passport?  It wasn&#039;t on a US Passport.

Why&#039;s it important?  Something about the Constitution&#039;s citizenship qualification to be Commander-in-Chief.  

Kenny, 
If you had been honest in your post #12, you would have provided a citation to prove your claim.  Readers may draw their own conclusions as to your credibility.  

Additionally you don&#039;t suggest what paragraphs you challenge.

Have no valid argument or facts?  No problem, attack right?  

You said it yourself, &quot;...I’m too lazy&quot; (post #4)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Klute, post #11; once again you side step the question.  The question remains:</p>
<p>How did he get into the country when the US State Department prohibited travel there?  He was a 20 year old nobody college student.</p>
<p>He would not have received permission to travel to Pakistan on a US passport.  In 1980 the US did not permit dual citizenship or the holding of two passports (unless you were from Israel).</p>
<p>We know he stayed with a friends family &#8211; how&#8217;d he get passed customs and on what passport?  It wasn&#8217;t on a US Passport.</p>
<p>Why&#8217;s it important?  Something about the Constitution&#8217;s citizenship qualification to be Commander-in-Chief.  </p>
<p>Kenny,<br />
If you had been honest in your post #12, you would have provided a citation to prove your claim.  Readers may draw their own conclusions as to your credibility.  </p>
<p>Additionally you don&#8217;t suggest what paragraphs you challenge.</p>
<p>Have no valid argument or facts?  No problem, attack right?  </p>
<p>You said it yourself, &#8220;&#8230;I’m too lazy&#8221; (post #4)</p>
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		<title>By: Kenny Jacobs</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-152851</link>
		<dc:creator>Kenny Jacobs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 18:23:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-152851</guid>
		<description>Veritas, you have lifted word-for-word sections of two different (and like you, anonymous) attack emails that circulated about then Senator Obama during late 2007 and 2008. Congratulations, you are ready to move up to World Net Daily. Adding the bit about Dar al Islam appears to be &quot;original&quot; to you. Keep recirculating paranoid rumors and don&#039;t worry when people like those innocent police officers in Pittsburgh get caught, literally, in the crossfire of your &quot;culture war.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Veritas, you have lifted word-for-word sections of two different (and like you, anonymous) attack emails that circulated about then Senator Obama during late 2007 and 2008. Congratulations, you are ready to move up to World Net Daily. Adding the bit about Dar al Islam appears to be &#8220;original&#8221; to you. Keep recirculating paranoid rumors and don&#8217;t worry when people like those innocent police officers in Pittsburgh get caught, literally, in the crossfire of your &#8220;culture war.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: The Klute</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-152838</link>
		<dc:creator>The Klute</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 17:22:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-152838</guid>
		<description>&quot;Klute, hate to break it to you pal, but Obama in fact visited Pakistan in 1980.&quot;

Wow.  That well-known fact causes me consternation.  Oh, wait, no it doesn&#039;t. 

&quot;No conspiracy, just want to know how he did it?&quot;

Probably the same way my various relations and an ex-girlfriend visited their countries (Czechoslovakia and Cuba) during times of political repression: they had relatives there and/or a sponsor. 

And look:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/04/obamas-college.html

&quot;After that visit, Obama traveled to Pakistan with a friend from college whose family was from there. The Obama campaign says Obama was in Pakistan for about three weeks, staying with his friend&#039;s family in Karachi and also visiting Hyderabad in Southern India.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Klute, hate to break it to you pal, but Obama in fact visited Pakistan in 1980.&#8221;</p>
<p>Wow.  That well-known fact causes me consternation.  Oh, wait, no it doesn&#8217;t. </p>
<p>&#8220;No conspiracy, just want to know how he did it?&#8221;</p>
<p>Probably the same way my various relations and an ex-girlfriend visited their countries (Czechoslovakia and Cuba) during times of political repression: they had relatives there and/or a sponsor. </p>
<p>And look:</p>
<p><a href="http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/04/obamas-college.html" rel="nofollow">http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/04/obamas-college.html</a></p>
<p>&#8220;After that visit, Obama traveled to Pakistan with a friend from college whose family was from there. The Obama campaign says Obama was in Pakistan for about three weeks, staying with his friend&#8217;s family in Karachi and also visiting Hyderabad in Southern India.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Veritas Vincit</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-152825</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas Vincit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 16:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-152825</guid>
		<description>Klute, hate to break it to you pal, but Obama in fact visited Pakistan in 1980.  No conspiracy at all.  Inquiring minds just want to know *how* he did it since a) he was a 20 year old student no-body at the time, and b) the US State Department did not allow US Citizens to travel to Pakistan.

No conspiracy, just want to know how he did it?

Kenny, ever been to Dar al Islam over in New Mexico?  Any idea who funds it?  If they can &quot;orient&quot; elementary school teachers during summer programs, they why not allow Oral Roberts University the same access to school kids?

Organizations with activist agenda&#039;s that are not in accord with the values of the parents should not have access to the classroom.

School kids are the &quot;prize&quot; in the culture wars exactly because they have no defenses.

I mean keeping both sides of the culture wars out of the classroom and, simply equipping children to reason, think, and learn - without instilling an agenda (like time spent on Global Warming or the Anti-War nonsense some classroom teachers engage in)

The classroom should be neutral and transparent to either side or their agenda.  Otherwise, the children are being molested - think about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Klute, hate to break it to you pal, but Obama in fact visited Pakistan in 1980.  No conspiracy at all.  Inquiring minds just want to know *how* he did it since a) he was a 20 year old student no-body at the time, and b) the US State Department did not allow US Citizens to travel to Pakistan.</p>
<p>No conspiracy, just want to know how he did it?</p>
<p>Kenny, ever been to Dar al Islam over in New Mexico?  Any idea who funds it?  If they can &#8220;orient&#8221; elementary school teachers during summer programs, they why not allow Oral Roberts University the same access to school kids?</p>
<p>Organizations with activist agenda&#8217;s that are not in accord with the values of the parents should not have access to the classroom.</p>
<p>School kids are the &#8220;prize&#8221; in the culture wars exactly because they have no defenses.</p>
<p>I mean keeping both sides of the culture wars out of the classroom and, simply equipping children to reason, think, and learn &#8211; without instilling an agenda (like time spent on Global Warming or the Anti-War nonsense some classroom teachers engage in)</p>
<p>The classroom should be neutral and transparent to either side or their agenda.  Otherwise, the children are being molested &#8211; think about it.</p>
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		<title>By: Kenny Jacobs</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-152486</link>
		<dc:creator>Kenny Jacobs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 18:12:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-152486</guid>
		<description>Veritas, at least you admit you aren&#039;t writing about principles but once again dressing up partisan hackery with buzz words. Karl Rove would be very proud.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Veritas, at least you admit you aren&#8217;t writing about principles but once again dressing up partisan hackery with buzz words. Karl Rove would be very proud.</p>
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		<title>By: The Klute</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-152417</link>
		<dc:creator>The Klute</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 15:06:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-152417</guid>
		<description>Er, Clinton in &#039;92.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Er, Clinton in &#8217;92.</p>
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		<title>By: The Klute</title>
		<link>http://sonoranalliance.com/2009/04/04/idealist/comment-page-1/#comment-152415</link>
		<dc:creator>The Klute</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 15:06:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sonoranalliance.com/?p=4008#comment-152415</guid>
		<description>VV,

In regards to post #3, if you could keep trying to win the 2008 presidential election until, say, November 6th, 2012 - that would be great.  

Because you know what resonates with the American voter? Unhinged conspiracy theories about secret meetings in a foreign country.  I mean, after all, it prevented Bill Clinton from becoming president in &#039;96 and Obama in &#039;08.  It&#039;s a winning strategy and I strongly suggest the GOP should incorporate it into any and all upcoming strategies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>VV,</p>
<p>In regards to post #3, if you could keep trying to win the 2008 presidential election until, say, November 6th, 2012 &#8211; that would be great.  </p>
<p>Because you know what resonates with the American voter? Unhinged conspiracy theories about secret meetings in a foreign country.  I mean, after all, it prevented Bill Clinton from becoming president in &#8217;96 and Obama in &#8217;08.  It&#8217;s a winning strategy and I strongly suggest the GOP should incorporate it into any and all upcoming strategies.</p>
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